Okay, you've just made me realize why I prefer Suikoden I to Suikoden II so immensely.
As you point out, Suikoden I is full of obvious villains that later become to some degree sympathetic, understandable, or relatable as people. ...Suikoden II is mainly the opposite. It's full of people who begin as sympathetic characters and, through their choices, end up being villains/opposing each other. (Suikoden V is the same way, which is probably why I liked it all right but never got really sucked into it as much.)
Both stories do say "the opposing side has their own reasons for their choices", and that's why they both have the feeling of a Suikoden sense of personhood, injustice, and the horrible unfairness when people have to fight each other. But I feel like stories where a sympathetic person becomes a villain aren't unique and they don't teach much. Most people have, somewhere in their lives, someone who's betrayed them or something, or perhaps disillusionment with idols or even their parents, and they're perfectly capable of imagining a sympathetic person ending up on the other side of a huge disagreement, and the sadness that one feels thinking "how did it come to this?" That's familiar. It's easy. It teaches nothing. But there are far fewer times when people start out hating someone and everything they stand for, and end up completely forgiving and liking them. I feel like going in that direction demonstrates more. It opens more doors. It goes firmly against the redemptive justice narrative that media is so saturated with, and reminds people that there is a different way. It's the thing that I'm always looking at stories and wishing they had more of-- the thing that frustrates me because it so often doesn't seem to occur to people. So it feels to me like it's more important.
I was going to say that Suikoden III and IV match the pattern of the first game, which may also be why I latched on to them really hard despite IV being... eh... not as solid of a game, objectively speaking. But I realized that III actually mirrors BOTH patterns if you know who Luc is-- and only if you know, which is one of the reasons that playing the series in order is so very important. (Also, despite its being very majorly about different points of view all having their merits, it pulled that so early in the game that it lost some of its narrative punch. I mean, so early that some of the most impactful incidences of it were happening to characters you might not have met yet.)
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Date: Sun, Aug. 23rd, 2015 09:18 am (UTC)As you point out, Suikoden I is full of obvious villains that later become to some degree sympathetic, understandable, or relatable as people. ...Suikoden II is mainly the opposite. It's full of people who begin as sympathetic characters and, through their choices, end up being villains/opposing each other. (Suikoden V is the same way, which is probably why I liked it all right but never got really sucked into it as much.)
Both stories do say "the opposing side has their own reasons for their choices", and that's why they both have the feeling of a Suikoden sense of personhood, injustice, and the horrible unfairness when people have to fight each other. But I feel like stories where a sympathetic person becomes a villain aren't unique and they don't teach much. Most people have, somewhere in their lives, someone who's betrayed them or something, or perhaps disillusionment with idols or even their parents, and they're perfectly capable of imagining a sympathetic person ending up on the other side of a huge disagreement, and the sadness that one feels thinking "how did it come to this?" That's familiar. It's easy. It teaches nothing. But there are far fewer times when people start out hating someone and everything they stand for, and end up completely forgiving and liking them. I feel like going in that direction demonstrates more. It opens more doors. It goes firmly against the redemptive justice narrative that media is so saturated with, and reminds people that there is a different way. It's the thing that I'm always looking at stories and wishing they had more of-- the thing that frustrates me because it so often doesn't seem to occur to people. So it feels to me like it's more important.
I was going to say that Suikoden III and IV match the pattern of the first game, which may also be why I latched on to them really hard despite IV being... eh... not as solid of a game, objectively speaking. But I realized that III actually mirrors BOTH patterns if you know who Luc is-- and only if you know, which is one of the reasons that playing the series in order is so very important. (Also, despite its being very majorly about different points of view all having their merits, it pulled that so early in the game that it lost some of its narrative punch. I mean, so early that some of the most impactful incidences of it were happening to characters you might not have met yet.)
tl;dr I really should read this book, yes.